Food Education & Flavor: Chef Susanne Grier’s Story

Imagine elevating your culinary skills by learning from the very best—Chef Susanne Grier shares her wisdom, passion, and resiliences in this heartening episode. Discover the secrets behind working with farm-fresh ingredients as we spotlight dishes like marinated and smoked goat meat from Happy Tails Farm. Hear about the intricate flavors of fondant potatoes and miso-rubbed pistachio-dusted cauliflower, and the challenge of crafting a sumptuous whipped goat cheese with lemon marmalade. This is not just a cooking lesson; it’s a journey through the art of culinary excellence.

Chef Susanne Grier’s story is one of overcoming societal barriers and finding her true calling. From facing gender biases to transitioning from a fine arts degree to becoming a corporate executive chef, Susanne’s journey is as inspiring as it is educational. She discusses the balance between her career and personal life, especially her role as a mother to an autistic daughter, and how she found fulfillment in culinary education. Her heartfelt stories from Center Grove and her commitment to nurturing young chefs offer invaluable insights into the importance of mentorship and compassion in the kitchen.

The latter part of our conversation shifts focus to the connection between educators and students, the importance of inclusivity, and the challenges of culinary program funding. Chef Susanne

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Chapters

• 1:04 Food Podcast With Chef Suzanne Greer
• 8:51 Chef Suzanne Greer
• 19:14 Educating and Mentoring Young Chefs
• 27:09 Passion and Leadership in Culinary Education
• 34:12 Culinary Program Funding Challenges

Transcript

Speaker 1: 1:05

hello food fam. This is the walk and talk podcast where you will find the perfect blend of food fun and cooking knowledge. I'm your host, carl fiordini. Welcome to the number one food podcast in the country. We're recording on site at ibisages Studios, where food photography comes alive and I get to eat it. If you missed it, last week we had food writer Amy Drew Thompson and we spoke about all things grilled cheese. You need to go check it out. It was a delicious episode. If you will, I want to give a big thanks to Vicki Webster, owner of Happy Tales Farm, for providing the goat meat and ham for today's delicious dishes. Find out more on Facebook at Happy Tails Farm. She's super cool small independent farmer and you know what. Check her out.

Speaker 1: 1:52

Walk Talk is going to be on site at the University of Tennessee this month to cover an episode of Kitchen Storage Makeover. This is an amazing contest created by Metro Storage and Distribution Systems. Walk Talk's own Pooch Rivera and Glenn Haggerty of Pious Media will be capturing all of the behind-the-scenes action, actione. Learn how to become a contestant on IG at Metro Food Service. Yeah, something was happening with my voice there. Don't you dare judge me until you do this yourself. All right. Our guest this week is a powerhouse in culinary education with 30 years of experience and a knack for transforming budding chefs into champions. Oh wow, with accolades like Indiana New Pro Star, teacher of the Year and the National Presidential Medallion from the American Culinary Federation, her impact is undeniable, but it's her students' impressive achievements that truly showcase her expertise. Chef Suzanne Greer is on deck. More on that in a moment. Jefferson, I mean, jump into that pre-shift baby. Explain the dishes. I mean we got goat and all kind of good.

Speaker 3: 3:05

By the way, that sammy was fired yeah, it's just when you have like I told you guys yesterday, the one bite was just exquisite and when you have somebody like vicky and her family that raise chickens and raise goats and then her daughter does the soap and they do goat cheese and goat milk and so on and so forth, you get to really taste their passion, what they have for the well-being of the animal, welfare, for that. And they gave me a leg that actually had the shoulder included on it. So it was really cool for me to fabricate that. And then we marinated it, brined it for three days in jerk and coconut rum and then we smoked it yesterday with some hickory smoke and it just it came out phenomenal. It just was just unbelievable. And then she raises also Kuni Kuni, which it's a. It's a type of breed of pig from New Zealand and it's known more for charcuterie because of the fat cap that animal has. It just exponentially has this fat cap. That's just gorgeous. It has a lot of flavor and a lot of complexity to it.

Speaker 3: 4:08

She gave me the ham. So this is actual food that she's going to have for her family because unfortunately her husband, mike, was trying to fix something on their smoker, forgot to put a cover on something and one of the goats decided to eat the wiring, so the smoker went down. So they asked me hey, could you do this? And I'm like sure, could you mind if I take a little? You know, there's the devil's cut, there's the angel's cut. Well then there's the wit cut, which is the walk and talk cut, and that's what we did.

Speaker 3: 4:36

So I showcased ham as an entree today, with my peach marmalade and bourbon that was actually marinated and brined for those three days as well. And then I did some melted potatoes, or also fondant tomatoes, which is very French butter and more butter and more butter and a little chicken stock, salt pepper and butter, if I didn't mention that. And then you roast them or sear them off and they put them in the oven and roast them for about an hour and they literally melt in your mouth. They're phenomenal. And then I put some leeks in there and I smoked the leeks as well. And then for the crudita, for me, I did a miso, rubbed pistachio, dusted cauliflower and smoked it.

Speaker 3: 5:16

And when I first tasted it I was like, why does this taste like tahini or peanut butter? This is really. Why is my mouth, my taste buds, not really registering what I think I'm supposed to be tasting, but that actually turned out to be something that was delicious as well. And then, the last but not least, is the whipped goat cheese with a lemon marmalade, a little bit of scotch bonnet, some fresh thyme and some fresh garlic. Since John doesn't like mayonnaise mayonnaise I didn't want to introduce any mayonnaise to this one. I did sweet plantains, roasted them down and then pure, pureed them into this beautiful mix. I layered that on with some roasted peppers and then pickled, wickled pickle, spiced onions in that smoked goat, and it was just phenomenal. On the sourdough, tell me more about the butter and that smoked goat.

Speaker 1: 6:01

it was just phenomenal On the sourdough. Tell me more about the butter.

Speaker 3: 6:06

There was a ton.

Speaker 1: 6:08

Oh, my goodness, yeah, I have to tell you. So the goat sammy hit the spot for me. You know the ham as an entree, what you did there also very good. And you know I think we're going to probably see a lot more product from Vicki's Farm from Happy Tales coming into future episodes.

Speaker 3: 6:28

I will say this. There was a lot of pressure on me, because when a farmer gives you first of all, that's the ham that I used.

Speaker 1: 6:35

I'm sorry, when is the walk-in, Because you know what. You can go cry in there.

Speaker 3: 6:38

It's not crying. I just want to point out that when they entrust somebody like myself to fabricate that pig which I broke that pig down, wilbur that ham and then to have it come back and then me smoke it and then treat it the way the passion that she and her family have, I wanted to make sure that trans, you know, transferred over for what I was doing for her family, because it's a huge monument, it's a huge thing or an honor to do, because they raised that animal and they had the care for that animal. They want to eat that animal for their family so that they can actually have substance. I got to make sure I do a damn good job. So there's a lot of pressure to make sure you're doing it and you're making it stand out the way she was raising that animal. That's the pressure I was talking about.

Speaker 1: 7:24

All right, but you know what You're built for this. Oh yeah, I mean you have. I mean your forearms are tattooed with uh well, now I need a goat. Yeah, now you're on your chest, I do one.

Speaker 3: 7:49

Oh yeah, empty spot right there. Okay, I could do that. Or the carrot and then do, like the breakdown of the butcher of the carrot goat to be cooler, she oh, by the way, she's doing a goat yoga and she wants to do like a goat yoga with the veterans too, which is really cool, and I feel like I need a little yoga in my with the way your l7 is going or l5?

Speaker 1: 7:57

well, I think what? So the last time I tried something anything to do with yoga, which was probably around 20 years ago, it was, it for me was awful.

Speaker 3: 8:07

I would never, I would never do that again, I would pay good money for him to watch him do a yoga session for like a minute. How much money? A dollar? Oh yeah, no, it's not big money.

Speaker 1: 8:16

Come on, not worth it at all for me to to put this oh, it's not, it's not big money, come on, not worth it at all for me to put this on oh, it's so worth it for us.

Speaker 3: 8:22

with all these cameras around us.

Speaker 1: 8:24

I would love, I mean, if we put like a pond together and everybody starts putting cash into this thing. Maybe I'll do it. Well, you just go ahead mention it, I just did. I just did and you don't have to find like a charity or something to push that cash over. I would do that for a charity. If people wanted to do this, I might have a charity for you.

Speaker 3: 8:42

She might be on the phone.

Speaker 1: 9:26

Is that right? Uh-huh, is that right? All right, let's assure Chef Suzanne Greer. Onto the show. Chef, how are you today?

Speaker 2: 9:38

I didn't take lives, so it's a good day. I love it. I think I only crushed a few dreams and ate a few souls, but I'm good to go you know what?

Speaker 1: 9:49

where have you been all my life?

Speaker 2: 9:51

I mean seriously just been waiting for you and here we are.

Speaker 1: 9:55

You know, leading up to this, leading up to the actual recording time, moments ago, I wish we were recording the you know, know this, this I don't know for about a minute and a half that we were talking. You said some incredibly funny things that I'm not bringing up on air now.

Speaker 2: 10:15

I hope Jeffrey told you what I told him the first time I met him. It was love at first word vomit.

Speaker 1: 10:23

I love it. I really do do. You guys are two peas in a pod. I warned you that she's the female version of me. Yeah, that's scary. In in every single capacity you have no idea.

Speaker 3: 10:33

It was very scary for me and I'm like you are, me and the females. We went to alone shia's restaurant when we were in new orleans when we first met. Yeah, and I can't even tell you the words that she off air. I will what she said to Chef Alon Shaya yeah, it's that bad.

Speaker 1: 10:53

All right, all right, all right Because we can't talk about it, and that is not fair to the audience. Really it's not fair.

Speaker 2: 10:59

It's not fair to me right now. My sincere condolences.

Speaker 1: 11:03

Indeed. All right, chef, why don't you take a minute and frame out who you are and how long you've been in the industry, and then we'll dive into some questions, okay.

Speaker 2: 11:22

Well, I started at 17 washing dishes and it's pretty interesting because the catering company said we normally do not hire females. And I'm like, well, put me on a trial. And they're like we should only hire women to do dishes. I'm like, okay, whatevs. But here's a high school student that was excited to come home. This is, you know, pre-food Network. You know, remember that series, great Chefs. You know, great Chefs of the Southeast, great Chefs of the Northeast. That was on PBS back in the day. I'd run home and watch that.

Speaker 2: 11:55

So me getting a job in a restaurant, I was pretty excited and they had like a baking area. And you know, here's this 16, 17 year old kid asking the bakers why didn't my rolls rise? Why didn't this? They're like, why are you asking? Like you're asking way involved questions. And I moved up within there. But my dad said I'm not sending you to culinary school because that's not a real profession. Said, I'm not sending you to culinary school because that's not a real profession.

Speaker 2: 12:25

And at that time we made an agreement I could major in fine art if I got an education degree. So I went to a small liberal arts school out in Iowa called Coe College where I got my fine art education. But guess what? I kept on having my toe in that hospitality industry because it's the only industry that I felt normal, I felt accepted, I felt I could be myself. And it's really weird. You know existing where you feel like you're a dangling part of support, like you do not belong. But to suddenly walk in a kitchen and find your tribe is very like soul fulfilling. And after I did my student teaching I was certified K-12 art ed. My elementary teacher I worked with she said Suzanne, if you do not teach, you're doing a disservice to children. I mean, that's a pretty powerful thing to hear. I love kids, I love the process, I love watching people learn. But it's the politics of education that I was like. I'm not ready for this. It just fires me up too much.

Speaker 2: 13:35

So I went back in the industry after I graduated and I worked with a wonderful chef mentor, chef Matthew Line out of Cincinnati. When I was working with him he encouraged me to go to culinary school. So I went to a night weekend program that Sullivan University had and moved down there and I became a corporate executive chef pretty fast and met my husband, moved to Ohio and it's interesting because when we got transferred to Indiana, I felt it was time to go back into education and I came to teach at Ivy Tech Community College baking, pastry arts, and then I started judging post-art and skills and I'm like this is some pretty cool, dynamic stuff. And I tapped into that community and you know, life is very serendipitous. There was a point in my life where both my parents were sick, my dad passed away and in between my dad and my mom passing away there was 31 days apart. So they passed 31 days apart, a month shy of their 50th Colleague of mine, brad Nair. It's like, have you thought about about teaching high school? And I was like, shoot, yeah, let's do it. You know it's. You can call it a guide moment, you can call it, you know, universe moment. But I felt like I was called to do that and that's.

Speaker 2: 14:55

I taught at J Brett Light Career Center on the north side of Indy for for three years but my daughter's autistic and driving an hour each way was just not conducive for our life. So my local school district, center Grove, they approached me to start their culinary program and I've been here for five years and just the impact, you know I always say being a career in tech education, a career tech educator, you not only have to be a very highly proficient educator, but you also have to know your craft, because you know I'll tell you what the kids can smell a rat a mile away. So you better know exactly what you're doing and how you're doing it. But on top of that it's creating those human connections and being a soft place for these kids to land. You know, here today I'm teaching about knives and small wares and then in my culinary three class we're reviewing measurements and I noticed one of my students was gone and I have a good relationship.

Speaker 2: 15:59

Come to find out that individual's parents passed away unexpectedly. Come to find out that individual's parents passed away unexpectedly and the amount of kids that have experienced profound loss, all the different social dynamic aspects. I get it. I'm there for them, my heart goes out to them. So you know you could be told one thing that's just absolutely devastating and then turn around and have to teach a class but respect that student's privacy and I think through that process the kids feel safe, they feel welcome, they don't feel judged, judged. It's amazing how supported I am with my admin here at the high school, the school board and just the community in general, the outpouring of support. When I've taken them to, you know, one of my students went to nationals, her parents were all in and very, very supportive. I just, of course, not everything's sunshine and rainbows, but it's where I need to be and it's very fulfilling. But it sure does have its challenges.

Speaker 1: 17:04

It's pretty amazing everything you've said so far, because that's that's the so. Whenever you're in a leadership role, mentorship role, you're in charge of something. Obviously, when you're dealing with your students, your personnel, just people you know employees, whatnot you must understand and respect what's happening. You know in somebody's life and you know that's just what we should all try to attain. How long, susan chef, have you been in as a chef? How long actually, have you been in that title?

Speaker 2: 17:39

Oh, I would say probably about 10 years.

Speaker 1: 17:46

And as an executive chef and as an educator, how long?

Speaker 2: 17:49

12.

Speaker 1: 17:50

Okay, so what is it that actually inspired you to transition from you know, a successful culinary career to a more dedicated role in education?

Speaker 2: 18:04

Well, when I was I was a chef in Dayton Ohio my husband came home and said we're being transferred to the greater Indianapolis area. Yeah, I always tell my students and people I mentor listen to the song of your heart. If you listen to the song of your heart, you will find the places you need to go. And sometimes the places we need to go are very challenging places and spaces. And we came to Indiana I right away got the job doing all the pastries for the NFL honors and that was really cool. I've had amazing opportunities to be in really cool spaces and places. That's been fun.

Speaker 2: 18:49

But am I feeding my soul? And I think it's one thing to have food in our craft feed our soul but when you have the heart to give back, I felt like's one thing to have food in our craft feed our soul but when you have the heart to give back, I felt like I had more to give back. And teaching at the college was great. But to see the impact, what I've done in my I'm in my eighth year of being a high school teacher. These are my kids. I don't call them my students, they're my kids. They come in. I look at their eyes. I'm like your eyes are telling a story. What's going on? What's happening? You know they. They come to me if they have, you know, thoughts of suicide or self-harm, and you know I love that's the bell for the end of the school day. But it's, you know, when I go to, when I go to a kid's hockey game or I go to a kid's football game or choir concert, they're like chef, chef, chef. You know to see them. I am just not just their educator, I am their mentor. They come to me with problems and situations. Or if I see a kid sleeping, I ask the question why? If I see a kid that's misbehaving and making poor choices, I ask why are we acting like this? What's happening? Because nine out of ten times it's something that's going on in their personal life that's causing them to act out, that's causing them to sleep.

Speaker 2: 20:19

At my previous school district I had this really cool student awesome kid, excuse me and he suddenly started sleeping all the time. So I was like dude, why are you sleeping all the time? What's happening? He's like Chef, my mom lost her job. Okay, 18-year-old senior kid and I'm working third shift at FedEx. Do you think I showed that kid compassion and kindness? Absolutely. You are supporting your complete family and I just said to him I got you. You just are still required to do the work, but I understand if you got to take a schnooze, because supporting your family, paying the rent, putting food on the table, is more important than the content I'm teaching you and sometimes what I teach is important, but I'm also teaching daily life lessons of just how to be a good freaking human being.

Speaker 1: 21:12

It's super important to. When you come across a situation like that, communication is so important. You know just the fact that you're reaching out and acknowledging that, hey, you're having something terrible going on in your, in your life, and you being you being the educator, you're being respectful and professional at the same time with, with, with a student, with an issue. That's the first step. You know, growing up, you know seventies, eighties, you didn't really get that. You know it wasn't the same. There was a disconnect a little bit different.

Speaker 2: 21:50

The overarching thing I hear all the time you're not like the other teachers. I don't want to be like the other teachers, but I'm also teaching you guys how to be good employees, good humans. Like I tell my kids, if I put you in a restaurant, you're coming with my name, I am backing you and like that alone, they understand the heaviness and the importance that I believe in you enough to send you to one of the best bakeries and, in my opinion, one of the best bakeries in Indiana Leviathan. You know I know those guys. I know they're going to take care of my kids and be respectful and be thoughtful with them and it's also providing an opportunity to all kids.

Speaker 2: 22:34

It's amazing how many students I have who have different disabilities or muscle issues or intellectual disabilities. I firmly believe everyone has a place at the table, but everyone's place setting is different, so you have to modify and adjust to that individual. You know that kid that has really profound autism, that's really good at doing repetitive things. He has a place in our industry. That individual that has some intellectual disabilities, that can work and be present in a kitchen and do some minor things, let's bring them on and you know, when you're managing a classroom, you have every aspect of the social, economic, diaspora and intellectual prowess.

Speaker 2: 23:26

I mean, I have everything from the top 20 student out of 650 kids, all the way down to a kid that's just in here to learn social interaction, a kid that's just in here to learn social interaction. So it's hard to meet everyone's needs at the same time, but you find a place to meet and on top of that, I always get frustrated when I hear industry chefs go oh, that's teaching. That's where people who can't cook that's where they go. Well, I challenge anyone to teach your craft to students. And how do you make it entertaining, embracing, engaging and then understand what they're learning versus the output?

Speaker 3: 24:11

Yeah, that's, that's something that you and I have talked about that before. I mean, cause I've I worked on the sales aspect of it and I was, I was like looked at as a well you, you gave up, so you're out of the industry, and that's like if and what was the old saying, those that can't handle it could teach it. And I think that's completely wrong. I think, because we all need mentors to teach, we all need people to teach. When you and I, carl I'm pointing at at you you and I met one of her students who was a success and we texted suzanne and he was at the world food championship if you're expecting me to remember brady, okay, okay, yeah, yeah yep, brady, brady actually yeah he went through the competition.

Speaker 3: 24:55

I think something he was from, wasn't he like doing pro star, or how did he get there? What?

Speaker 1: 25:01

was his story doing pastry. What was he doing? No, he was. He was doing one of the competitions.

Speaker 3: 25:04

They mentioned his name from being in indiana and I had asked him do you know suzanne greer? And he's like, oh my god, she's my chef. And that's when I called suzanne I was like, hey, by the way, I got our son here well, I and you've worked with Macy Runkle too.

Speaker 2: 25:21

You got to meet Macy at one of the national competitions. I always say once my kid, always my kid. It just doesn't stop. Now I worked with Brady when I was an adjunct professor at Ivy Tech Community College. That's where I met him Really dynamic student, tech Community College that's where I met him Really dynamic student. And he's worked with some of the other chefs within the Indianapolis community and he's part of Team Indiana. So those guys are all riling up for the World Food Championship that will be here in November and that's how he ended up going to the World Foods. He's just such a quality individual that has a very thought provoking and powerful story and when I knew you guys were down there, I was like you got to talk to this guy. He's just, he's engaging, dynamic. He's, you know, the kind of person you want to talk to.

Speaker 1: 26:15

Well, that's interesting. So, as an educator, how do you, is there a particular strategy that you employ to prepare students to get involved in high state competitions? You know whether that's regional or national or whatnot. I mean, is there something that you do to kind of, you know, get them ready for that?

Speaker 2: 26:35

I look at the individual student. I don't look at their GPA, I look at who they are. What is your interest? Is this your passion? Is this what you really want to do? And, oddly enough, the byproduct I see is my students who are involved with athletics. I played high school and college soccer, so that takes a lot of time and dedication and focus. Well, what does you know? Food, sports, competition that's what it is. It takes a lot of dedication, time.

Speaker 2: 27:09

Like my kids and I, we practice from nine to two on saturdays and we're a. We just do skills. Usa and we. We have to have tryouts. Most schools don't have the opportunity to tryouts because they don't have enough interest and they, the kids, come out. But they have to try out. They have. I watch them. What's their workflow, what's their thought process? Do they even practice proper sanitation? And then that's where we go and these kids, they show up. I tell them also you know you have to practice at home If you want to be a champion. It takes time. But I also tell my kids be a compassionate human being. In the kitchen, you see someone struggling. Give them some supportive words.

Speaker 2: 28:00

Like our first year of doing skills, I was so proud of my kids. We didn't. I mean, we went to state. We showed very respectfully. But what made me so happy, it was my students that stopped, hugged the student that was struggling and helped them to finish Like. To me, that's true character and that's more important than first place. Now, do I like getting, do I like winning and placing? Absolutely, I'm a competitive individual.

Speaker 1: 28:27

I mean I have to tell you. I mean I'm kind of in like the Cobra Kai camp, you know, sweep the leg. You know what I mean. Like let's, I'm kidding. Yeah, you're more than mr miyagi and he's more the cobra kai. Yeah, like, more like uh, joey what's it lawrence? What's his name? I forgot joey lawrence. Is it joey lawrence? The?

Speaker 2: 28:49

bad guy karate kid oh, I don't know his lawrence, I don't know ralph macho, no, he was the good guy, but the other one.

Speaker 3: 28:52

But the character's name? I don't remember the character's name.

Speaker 1: 28:55

All right. So let me ask you a question. So, chef, is it pastry only, or is it savory also? Where do you draw the line?

Speaker 2: 29:09

Well, I do both. I always say I'm a bipolar chef.

Speaker 3: 29:14

Who isn't?

Speaker 2: 29:15

I could go either way. I know I always tell my students look, look, I got you. I deal with anxiety and depression. Yay, winner, winner. Chicken dinner. I'm like welcome to the world of adhd. Fun, enjoy.

Speaker 2: 29:28

But I I primarily what I'm really good at, and a good technician is pastry. I, I am a certified executive pastry chef. I do a lot of freelance work just in pastry and that is my preference. I think I'm a stronger pastry coach than culinary coach. But I really believe in collaborative learning environments. So I team up with other chef instructors, high school chef instructors that are doing skills, and I will work with their bakers and they'll work with my culinary kids so they get a different perspective and view. Because to me a win for a student is a win for a student. You know, it's nice when I can say look at my center group of kids, they're fabulous. But the flip side, when I've worked with a student at a different school and I see them do well, that makes me happy and it was really cool. The other not this past year but the year prior how my students became good friends with the other school students and they cheered each other on and I'm like that's what it's all about.

Speaker 1: 30:36

How are you doing?

Speaker 2: 30:36

community connection.

Speaker 1: 30:38

How are you doing all of this? And you're, if I'm not mistaken, you're still in pursuit of your master's degree, correct? Yes, like what kind of human are you? I don't, I don't, I'm just trying to super woman. Seriously yeah.

Speaker 3: 30:50

How are you managing that? And and she also has to manage the home too with the autistic child, little chef.

Speaker 2: 30:56

And my husband's working in Michigan, so I'm pretty much a single mom Monday through Friday.

Speaker 1: 31:02

I mean, how much coffee are you drinking?

Speaker 3: 31:04

About as much as me.

Speaker 2: 31:06

A lot of coffee and fermented water.

Speaker 1: 31:11

I love the fermented water. I can dig it, it's fantastic.

Speaker 2: 31:17

So I'll be graduating December 14th with my master's in career and tech education. I'm also the president-elect of Indiana Association of Career and Technical Educators. It's a passion of mine. I know I'm insane. Wait a second, I'm insane. He just rolled his eyes literally. I can't wait for this to come out.

Speaker 3: 31:39

No, no, no, because he was like are you kidding me? That's the look Stop.

Speaker 1: 31:43

Okay, I'm an overachiever. Is it this December that you're graduating?

Speaker 2: 31:49

Yes, this December.

Speaker 1: 31:50

Okay, okay, and after this you're going to get into physics or something. What are you jumping into next?

Speaker 2: 31:57

Well, I'm looking to become an astrophysicist now. That is not my gift. No, I promised everyone, I'm done. I've had people go what about your PhD? And I'm like nope, that's too much writing, that is not my gift. You say nope now, today.

Speaker 1: 32:15

But I have a feeling I have this itching Just listening to you, for you know 25 minutes, I'm pretty certain that you're going to be like you know what? Just, you know, this is not enough, masters, not enough. Yeah, you're going to go for your PhD. Of course you are.

Speaker 2: 32:33

Well, it's one of those things. If I do it, we'll see. You know, life is fascinating, life is interesting and I think if you leave yourself open to opportunities, opportunities come your way. You know, the energy you put out in the world is what you get back. And I put it out and I got Jeffrey. So I don't know what my energy says about that.

Speaker 1: 32:54

Put your energy away. All right, that's what I say to that. The energy must be put. Put your energy away. That's what I say to that. The energy must be put. Lock your energy in the basement, along with Jeffrey Kidding.

Speaker 2: 33:05

Well, Jeffrey and I live in the gutter together, so it works out.

Speaker 1: 33:10

Jeffrey's like Chunk over here, not Chunk, you're Goonies.

Speaker 3: 33:15

Hey you guys.

Speaker 1: 33:15

Hey you guys, chunky Baby Roof. Yeah, hey you guys. Hey you guys, john Rookley Baby Roof.

Speaker 2: 33:22

Okay, Baby Roof. See, but you did that, I did it, but I didn't realize you did that.

Speaker 1: 33:29

I should have realized Squirrel, yes. I should have realized that by opening that door, you guys were going to fully just dive through it, all right. Or you guys were going to fully just dive through it, all right. In what ways has your leadership within the American Culinary Federation, how?

Speaker 2: 33:49

has it shaped the future of culinary education? That's a great question. A lot of my local chapter members say I'm a glass ceiling breaker and it takes a lot. It takes a lot of perseverance and a lot of gusto to really want to break ceilings and be that flagship person. And I was the first female chapter president of the Greater Indianapolis ACF and what I was really proud about our chapter is our sheer diversity. People think of ACF. I don't think they think of diversity. At our local chapter it is 50-50 on gender. We have 31 different flavors of humanity. There's not one monoculture.

Speaker 2: 34:36

But what's happened is we created and cultivated this culture where educators come to our meetings more and more and more. I mean, if you're going to say the industry standard of excellence, let's be that, and our local chapters really has embraced it. Plus, it's our local chapter that does all the judging and evaluations, essentially for skills. Then we all go up to ProStart and do it. Plus, it's our local chapter that does all the judging and evaluations essentially for skills. Then we all go up to ProStart and do it and it's creating community and you know it depends. You're the flagship person, you're selling the juice and I think over the years being active here just locally. It's growing and I was really excited because last year was the first year acf did an educator summit and it was absolutely outstanding.

Speaker 2: 35:26

It was great. This year they did it and it was. It was good. It was good, it was very solid and it's interesting when you look at what high school culinary educators have to worry about versus college culinary educators and what they have to worry about. College culinary educators don't have to worry about IEPs, where we do, because that's a legal document. So we always have to be able to pivot and adjust and create a classroom where everyone is accepted, where when I taught college, I didn't know what people were dealing with. I mean it was kind of ironic that my first semester teaching college I was like, what are what's up with these two? These two, because I can't come out and say, hey, do you have autism? Hey, yeah, what's what's going on? But they offer, like I do these, these two kids, one had Tourette's and one had autism. I was like, oh, this is going to be interesting. But I feel with educators, we're constantly looking for continuing education opportunities and that's what ACF provides. So I don't know if I answered your question too much or not enough.

Speaker 1: 36:37

I think it was answered in the most perfect way what chapter? Where are you? Where's your chapter?

Speaker 2: 36:45

Indianapolis.

Speaker 1: 36:46

How many chapters is there? Only one in India.

Speaker 2: 36:50

So in Indiana we have three active ACF chapters One is South Bend and one is Northwest Indiana.

Speaker 1: 37:01

You're pretty excited about this year, with the World Food Championship actually being held over there.

Speaker 2: 37:10

I'm a certified eat judge now.

Speaker 3: 37:13

Oh she's like you.

Speaker 2: 37:16

That's fancy I'm bougie, they said I'm going to be a gold card. I'm like sweet.

Speaker 1: 37:22

I love what you're saying. Let's get to the brass tacks here. When are you cooking some desserts for me?

Speaker 3: 37:30

When you go to Indy.

Speaker 2: 37:32

Well, when you guys come, come to my house, I'll cook for you.

Speaker 1: 37:36

Oh wow, she sounded like I'll cook for you. Oh wow, she sounded like I'll cook for you. Oh sure, at first she was like Edith Bunker oh, Archie.

Speaker 2: 37:44

Oh, I'll be glad to cook for you. I always get asked are you a New York Jew? I said no, I'm screwed up. My mom's from the south side of Chicago, my dad's from Boston and I grew up in Cincinnati, so I'm all sorts of messed up.

Speaker 1: 37:58

Yeah, you're all sorts of stuff. I mean we have a Hollywood Jew here with Jeffrey, she knows.

Speaker 3: 38:04

In case the audience doesn't.

Speaker 2: 38:05

He is a fancy one.

Speaker 3: 38:06

Yeah, he's so fancy. So, Suzanne, one of the things you and I were talking about and I want to touch on this, you know there's Pam Bedford, who we respect, and she's a culinary instructor too, here in Florida and the Gainesville area, and you made a comment to me about the budget that you had left over and how much you get to spend that. Can you go through that for the audience, Because I wanted to showcase some of the issues that teachers in the high school realm depending upon or differ from the college?

Speaker 2: 38:36

You got. You have your pad of paper and pencil ready for this lesson.

Speaker 1: 38:43

Sure.

Speaker 2: 38:44

No, no, can we do cliff notes? Yeah, you can do cliff notes. I'm going to try to make this pretty quick and easy. So Carl D Perkins, back in the day, created a grant on the national level and each state applies for this grant. It's called the Carl D Perkins grant and you apply for it and there's like a metrics Indiana, for example, got 32 million dollars and let's say, ohio, right next to us, got $52 million. So that's a 20 million deficit and why I don't know. So what happens is the state of Indiana took their $32 million.

Speaker 2: 39:29

And then, if you are a career center, that's separate for high school and a career center is a learning space where various school districts send their students to, and those places get state and federal Perkins grant funding when I'm at a comprehensive high school and we only get state Perkins grant funding. So the way my program is funded is different than our local career center. Now I will tell you it's not earmarked to be directly used for any program. Like, my school district essentially pays a tuition to our local career center for the students that go there. Now we offer a lot of in-house CTE, career and technical education and I am very lucky to have a great school district and community and school board that really believes in my program and what we do. Through some grants and magic they built a $1.2 million commercial kitchen, but I do have like 600 kids in my culinary pathway.

Speaker 1: 40:43

How many?

Speaker 2: 40:43

kids 600. 600. Wow, I'm the only chef educator. My colleague, he comes more from the business side, which is great, and then we have a bunch of culinary one teachers that just have the right heart and they're learning as they're going and I just we make a really great cohesive team.

Speaker 2: 41:12

But career centers is a little different and the way funding trickles down to that that's what it is. In the state of Indiana, unfortunately, we cannot charge fees for school, like textbook fees, lab fees. So that's really hurt a lot of the career centers because then they don't get. Like part of the lab fee when I was at a career center was the uniform. Now they've got to find the money for that, whereas here we used to charge a lab fee that would help cover the cost of food. The district had to scramble and find money for that, ramble and find money for that and I got to. You know, give Center Grove schools a high five for really believing in what we are doing, the difference that we're making, because when it comes to our food budget we're not suffering when it comes to the food budget. Now the struggle is sometimes teaching people why we need certain things and then finding the money for certain equipment to help you know. Support the program.

Speaker 1: 42:29

It does. But I mean, I think money is always the biggest challenge when it comes to education. Well, you know, I take that back. I take that back because there's a ton of money on education.

Speaker 3: 42:42

I don't know if it's being applied properly's. Well, I mean, like what she's talking about is like how many saute pans and pots, and do you need right? You know?

Speaker 2: 42:47

18 like I need. I need 18 large saute pans. Well, we come in those. Come in all kinds of different price points. I have to use up this from a grant $325. We all know that 18-sauce saute pans are going to be more than that, but it's finding ways to have your program supported. In other scenarios. There are programs out there in small communities. They honestly have no idea where they're getting their money to help support their programs.

Speaker 1: 43:26

Suzanne, I have to tell you it would take 18 saucepans and a 325 to feed me alone. He's not kidding, oh I know, I mean. So when you look at the bigger picture here, yeah, that know the the bigger picture here, yeah, it's a big, that's a challenge and that's not enough and you should be getting no-transcript.

Speaker 3: 44:01

So what I'm trying to say is stop.

Speaker 2: 44:04

Well, what's interesting is I've been on part of different legislative committees to legislate the legislators, to educate them, and this was right before COVID and I went in and was talking to my representative. They were using a metric of data that was from the fast food industry in 2014, so they were saying that we're low need, we're in low need and low income, so they didn't feel to put the money forth to really support culinary, where they're going to support STEM even more, because that's what each state does and how they decide how to fund certain pathways. And when I told my local representative, this is wrong. I have chef friends that make over six figures. I have people call me all the time looking for employees.

Speaker 2: 45:02

If you invest in your culinary program and we bring in our community restaurants into our facilities to meet and work with our students, you're going to create an environment where people want to work for you. You're going to create an environment where people want to work for you. You're going to create an environment where people feel supported and then they show up. But if you're not putting your money in an industry where there's a dire need, like anyone can show up to a restaurant these days and get a job, we are supplying a fill for the need. But these politicians really I'm like where do you get your information? Talk to Indiana Restaurant and Lodging Association. Those guys have a lot to say about needing employees.

Speaker 3: 45:55

Well, and that's the thing, right. I mean, we're trying to create this next generation. Have you gone to like country clubs and talked to those chefs, especially within your chapter? I know like we used to have a place in Palm Beach called the Lord's Place and maybe you're as a soul, robert Coleman was a chef there and they were taking people that were homeless and then giving them the education to go into the classrooms and one of the things and how they were funded was cheney brothers, which is a small supplier here in florida. They would give them and donate to them and then, like some places, like joseph waters, who you know, who was my v, my first ep, over in acf of palm beach, he would donate equipment. If they got new pots and new pans, they would take the old ones and donate it to them. Do you have kind of that, that collaboration with your chapter members that they can help out, maybe fill those voids of those different equipment? Can you do that?

Speaker 2: 46:53

I've there's. There's people that are willing to backfill in certain areas. We do have a really cool program here in Indianapolis called Second Helpings, and actually Brady's a graduate of this program. So it's they do hunger relief.

Speaker 3: 47:18

You okay, oh so hunger relief. You okay, oh so hunger relief.

Speaker 1: 47:23

I would love to have you know to get involved with that in some way. So I mean, how could we get involved?

Speaker 2: 47:32

Well, they have a great website I'd go to. I think it's secondhelpingsorg, and they do this wonderful six I think it's now to a six-week program where they give people that are in transition and jobs, homeless finding work, to people that are transitioning from halfway houses or previous incarceration. They give them wonderful job training to get them out there. Plus, they can go directly to Ivy Tech and already have some lack of a better term dual credits and then they can attend and get their associate's degree in culinary or baking. They get wonderful support within our community. Unfortunately, I don't really know enough to really talk about the exact way you can help, but I guarantee if you go to their website there's places to donate and ways to volunteer and support.

Speaker 1: 48:31

Well, I'll tell you what. Chef Suzanne, you are a cool cat, chef Suzanne you are a cool cat and I'm glad, I am super glad to have met you this way on air and I do look forward to meeting you in person. And I'm holding you to this whole pastry thing. Like I want to try your stuff.

Speaker 2: 48:54

Well, you're going to come down to the country, because I live out in the country and we will. We will eat some local food from local farmers and I'm happy to host a wonderful dinner at my house with you guys.

Speaker 1: 49:13

Looking forward to that. I just again, I appreciate you being on the air today. Vicki Webster, thank you again for the donation of lovely, lovely products from the farm Happy Tales here in Florida. All right, jeffrey, John Chef, suzanne. Thank you, we are out. We'll see you next time.